(no subject)
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Jesus Yepez
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2010 6:16 am
(no subject)
I just got a Honda Z, the car was not running for the past 15 years and I just want to know how can I get it to start running again. Can someone give me an advice on how to start the engine running or do I have to rebuild the motor. I will really appreaciate your help. Thank you.....
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richmccolman
- Posts: 39
- Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2012 9:47 am
getting z600 car running
Hey, wow - that's a potentially big topic, Jesus. Where to start?
The main things I would say to check initially are spark, fuel, and valve timing.
Valve timing:
Honda 600 cars are notorious for having the cam chain jump/slip once the chain has been in the car for 30,000-60,000 miles (depending upon how the car is driven), which throws off the valve timing. If the chain has slipped more than just a couple of teeth on the camshaft, the pistons can actually hit the valves and bend them.
To check the valve timing, take off the valve cover, and then turn the crankshaft until the small notch on the edge of the crankshaft belt pulley aligns with the 'T' mark on the engine housing next to the pulley. (I find that the easiest way to turn the crankshaft is to take off the parking brake, put the car into 4th gear, and pull the car forward by hand. Make sure to do this on level ground, not on a hill, of course!) This will make the engine turn slowly. Pull the car until the pulley notch aligns with 'T' mark. Now take the car out of gear and put the parking brake on. With the pulley notch aligned with the 'T' mark, check the right-hand (passenger) side of the camshaft sprocket and look for a straight line fainted etched across the sprocket. (You may have to look closely to see it. If the straight line is on down below the shaft of the camshaft, put the car into 4th gear again [parking brake off] and roll the car some more enough to make the crankshaft pulley notch go around one complete turn back to the 'T' mark.)
Anyway, with the pulley notch positioned at the 'T' and the straight line on the camshaft sprocket more or less above the camshaft, check the orientation of the line. It should be parallel to the top of the camshaft housing. If it's not close to being parallel, that means that the cam chain has jumped.
If it has jumped, one big question is whether it has jumped so far that the valves have been bent. You can tell this by putting the car back into 4th gear with the parking brake off, and pull the car forward again. If the valves are okay (not bent), you should have some amount of compression in the engine, meaning that at certain points as you're pulling the car forward by hand in 4th gear, you should encounter some extra resistance at various points when you're trying to move the car. Also, if there's engine compression, you should occasionally hear what sounds a little like air being being slowly let out of a balloon or squeezed out of plastic bottle with the cap opened a tiny amount. If you don't hear this sound and don't encounter extra resistance at certain points when pulling the car forward, then your valves are bent (or adjusted way too tight!) and you'll have to replace them and do at least a partial engine rebuild. If, on the other hand, it appears that the engine has compression, but the straight line on the camshaft sprocket wasn't parallel to the top edge of the camshaft housing (when the crankshaft pulley notch was aligned with the 'T' mark) then you'll need a new cam chain. (You can get a split chain from Bruce Whiting and use a special procedure to pull the new chain through the engine and link it together. But before doing that you should visually check the camshaft rollers to make sure they aren't too worn.)
If it turns out that the straight line on the camshaft sprocket is parallel to the top edge of the camshaft housing when the crank pulley notch is on 'T", then the valve timing should be good.
Spark:
Make sure there's a good battery in the car and that the starter will turn the engine over. Once you've done that, check to see if you have a good solid spark at the spark plug wires, and that the spark plugs are in decent shape. You can remove the plugs, and one at a time ground the outer metal part of each plug to the engine, with the spark plug plugged into its corresponding spark plug wire. One way you could ground the outer metal part of the spark plug is to use one side of a set of jumper cables -- clamping one clip/clamp of the cable to the outer metal part of the spark plug and the clamp at the other end of the same conductor to a ground point on the car, preferably the engine. (For this procedure, one wire in your jumper cables will remain unconnected at both ends.) Then have a friend turn the key to the start position while you watch for a spark between the spark plug electrodes as the engine turns. You should see a nice, bright spark if the ignition system is working okay. Check both plugs. If you don't get good spark, you've got a problem somewhere in the ignition system that needs fixing.
Fuel:
Make sure there's some fresh fuel in the tank, disconnect the fuel hose going to the carburetor, and hold the end of the hose into an open glass jar or similar container. Have your friend turn the key to the 'run' position. (You don't need to turn the engine with the starter for the test.) You should hear the fuel pump clicking and you should see fuel getting pumped into the jar at a fairly decent rate. If you don't get much or any fuel getting pumped into the jar, and you don't hear the pump clicking, then you have a problem in the fuel system.
These are the best things to start with, I think. If you have good valve timing, good spark at the spark plugs, and a good flow of fresh fuel, you most likely should get the engine to respond. (There could be a number of other issues that would need to be worked through such as ignition timing, a carburetor that needs rebuilding, etcetera, but the above items are the first things I'd check.)
It would help a lot to have a repair manual. You can download repair manual documents here:
http://www.honda600coupe.com/Manuals,_b ... ments.html
I recommend downloading the sedan repair manual as well as the coupe manual docs. For whatever reason, the info in the sedan manual is considerably more detailed than in the coupe manual. With only a few minor differences (such as the tachometer linkage), the coupe and sedan engines are just about the same.
Good luck -- let us know what you find out.
Richard
The main things I would say to check initially are spark, fuel, and valve timing.
Valve timing:
Honda 600 cars are notorious for having the cam chain jump/slip once the chain has been in the car for 30,000-60,000 miles (depending upon how the car is driven), which throws off the valve timing. If the chain has slipped more than just a couple of teeth on the camshaft, the pistons can actually hit the valves and bend them.
To check the valve timing, take off the valve cover, and then turn the crankshaft until the small notch on the edge of the crankshaft belt pulley aligns with the 'T' mark on the engine housing next to the pulley. (I find that the easiest way to turn the crankshaft is to take off the parking brake, put the car into 4th gear, and pull the car forward by hand. Make sure to do this on level ground, not on a hill, of course!) This will make the engine turn slowly. Pull the car until the pulley notch aligns with 'T' mark. Now take the car out of gear and put the parking brake on. With the pulley notch aligned with the 'T' mark, check the right-hand (passenger) side of the camshaft sprocket and look for a straight line fainted etched across the sprocket. (You may have to look closely to see it. If the straight line is on down below the shaft of the camshaft, put the car into 4th gear again [parking brake off] and roll the car some more enough to make the crankshaft pulley notch go around one complete turn back to the 'T' mark.)
Anyway, with the pulley notch positioned at the 'T' and the straight line on the camshaft sprocket more or less above the camshaft, check the orientation of the line. It should be parallel to the top of the camshaft housing. If it's not close to being parallel, that means that the cam chain has jumped.
If it has jumped, one big question is whether it has jumped so far that the valves have been bent. You can tell this by putting the car back into 4th gear with the parking brake off, and pull the car forward again. If the valves are okay (not bent), you should have some amount of compression in the engine, meaning that at certain points as you're pulling the car forward by hand in 4th gear, you should encounter some extra resistance at various points when you're trying to move the car. Also, if there's engine compression, you should occasionally hear what sounds a little like air being being slowly let out of a balloon or squeezed out of plastic bottle with the cap opened a tiny amount. If you don't hear this sound and don't encounter extra resistance at certain points when pulling the car forward, then your valves are bent (or adjusted way too tight!) and you'll have to replace them and do at least a partial engine rebuild. If, on the other hand, it appears that the engine has compression, but the straight line on the camshaft sprocket wasn't parallel to the top edge of the camshaft housing (when the crankshaft pulley notch was aligned with the 'T' mark) then you'll need a new cam chain. (You can get a split chain from Bruce Whiting and use a special procedure to pull the new chain through the engine and link it together. But before doing that you should visually check the camshaft rollers to make sure they aren't too worn.)
If it turns out that the straight line on the camshaft sprocket is parallel to the top edge of the camshaft housing when the crank pulley notch is on 'T", then the valve timing should be good.
Spark:
Make sure there's a good battery in the car and that the starter will turn the engine over. Once you've done that, check to see if you have a good solid spark at the spark plug wires, and that the spark plugs are in decent shape. You can remove the plugs, and one at a time ground the outer metal part of each plug to the engine, with the spark plug plugged into its corresponding spark plug wire. One way you could ground the outer metal part of the spark plug is to use one side of a set of jumper cables -- clamping one clip/clamp of the cable to the outer metal part of the spark plug and the clamp at the other end of the same conductor to a ground point on the car, preferably the engine. (For this procedure, one wire in your jumper cables will remain unconnected at both ends.) Then have a friend turn the key to the start position while you watch for a spark between the spark plug electrodes as the engine turns. You should see a nice, bright spark if the ignition system is working okay. Check both plugs. If you don't get good spark, you've got a problem somewhere in the ignition system that needs fixing.
Fuel:
Make sure there's some fresh fuel in the tank, disconnect the fuel hose going to the carburetor, and hold the end of the hose into an open glass jar or similar container. Have your friend turn the key to the 'run' position. (You don't need to turn the engine with the starter for the test.) You should hear the fuel pump clicking and you should see fuel getting pumped into the jar at a fairly decent rate. If you don't get much or any fuel getting pumped into the jar, and you don't hear the pump clicking, then you have a problem in the fuel system.
These are the best things to start with, I think. If you have good valve timing, good spark at the spark plugs, and a good flow of fresh fuel, you most likely should get the engine to respond. (There could be a number of other issues that would need to be worked through such as ignition timing, a carburetor that needs rebuilding, etcetera, but the above items are the first things I'd check.)
It would help a lot to have a repair manual. You can download repair manual documents here:
http://www.honda600coupe.com/Manuals,_b ... ments.html
I recommend downloading the sedan repair manual as well as the coupe manual docs. For whatever reason, the info in the sedan manual is considerably more detailed than in the coupe manual. With only a few minor differences (such as the tachometer linkage), the coupe and sedan engines are just about the same.
Good luck -- let us know what you find out.
Richard
--- In
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
, Jesus Yepez wrote:
> I just got a Honda Z, the car was not running for the past 15 years and I just want to know how can I get it to start running� again. Can someone give me an advice on how to start the engine running or do I have to rebuild the motor. I will really appreaciate your help. Thank you.....