--- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, wrote:
> Philip;
> I run and have run an oil cooler and remote oil filter with an oil thermostat for about 19 years. At first I too thought just knowing the oil temp was useful, and that an engine with a roller bearing crank would have low oil pressure anyway.
> So, I installed a temp gauge in my drain plug and the oil in a used engine stayed at roughly 165 to 180 on the free way. But when I drove off the free way it jumped to 220 and above at the first light. And after pulling and resealing with many repairs to these engines they all had signs of this problem as the inside cases were coated with tar from over heated oil. The same with the bearing cages, shift plate and transmission gears.
> This gave me the concern that no matter what I did with an engine using warn parts it will over heat. And the lower end is taking the worst of the situation. With that in mind, I developed an oil cooler with a remote oil spin on filter (ala VW application) with a 4 pass cooler, using a oil thermostat between the filter and the cooler coil. Which kept the engine oil going back to the engine until it started to reach 165 degrees. Then, I added a oil temp and pressure gauges plumed from the oil filter bracket. Placing the pressure gauge on the inlet side and the temp on the out side of the filter. I ran this Honda 600 coupe for about 40,000 miles. Every 10,000 I pulled the engine, disassembled it and measured everything. As most of the parts already had close to 40K or more on them I was looking for more wear than each part had on it before I started the test. So my bench mark was for this engine were measurements on used parts. With the exception of a new cam chain, cam chain rollers top an bottom, new pistons and a valve job, but most metal parts were used. After the first 10k there was no additional wear.
> What was I checking? Cam and drive chains, crank shaft bearings and bearing cages on the end bearings, drive sprockets and dampers, shift shaft, shift plate, all bearings, transmission ball bearing keepers (the exterior rings on the bearing) all seals, cam lobes and sprocket teeth and cam run out. As I was using a standard Honda Cam chain there were noticeable wear areas between the cam sprocket teeth, but the rocker arms showed no additional wear. And a general observation of the tar on the inside of the engine (there was no tar).
> At 20K I noticed some wear on the oil pump rod. As I had not changed it at first I did at that time. But, no other noticeable wear.
> At the 30K tear down I still had no noticeable wear and no tar.
> At the 40K tear down again, no noticeable wear but I noticed that the inner O ring on the drive ends of the differential were rock hard, I had not pulled them earlier as there was no leak. And, there still was no leak, but when I poked one of them it cracked. I changed oil every 3K with 20W30 and cut open the filter to look for metal chips. And I found a few, but the oil filter was doing it's job by collecting them at the bottom of the filter, not letting them go back into the case.
> Here are the stats;
> Oil temp 165 to 190, 190 was around town, got a bit higher in 80 degree heat and traffic.
> Oil pressure, cold 30 psi, warm 0 at idle and 9psi at 3K rpm
> Head temp 350. And, if you had a keen cert thread repair it went to 450. This was because the stainless steel insert seemed to get warmer. (I added that as I put a cylinder head gauge on an engine that I had used a Keen cert to repair the head to see what if any differences there were)
> A few months later I sold that coupe and restored another. But I still have Harry Lineback's Sedan that has had an oil cooler on it since 1991. I pulled and resealed the engine (I wanted to paint it (the engine)) But that was in 2007, and the inside of the engine was as clean as the day it was assembled in 1991.
> Back to your question, Does an oil gauge help?
> It will show when there are differences if you watch it.
> The cylinder head gauge gave indications of blow by which meant that your plug was ready to blow out. (got that info from the VW guys)
> The oil pressure gauge shows that there is pressure at speed and in engines where the oil pump rod did fail the engine stopped running. But where most have a seized cam and pistons, these engines didn't. And, I was able to repair the engine using the same parts other than changing the oil pump rod.
> What an oil cooler and large oil filter will do is give you more oil in your system, better filtering, and seemed to keep the engine from over heating and burning the oil on the inside of the engine. All of which are significant to wear.
> What an oil cooler doesn't do; it will not put extra stress on the oil pump or oil pump rod. If installed correctly the hoses can not be torn off where they are connected at the bottom of the engine.
> Go to the
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/anzhonda600owners/
site and look in the photo section. To see a Honda 600 with an oil cooler installed.
> Bill
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
]On Behalf Of Philip Apronti
> Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 7:07 PM
> To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [anzhonda600owners] Re: Installation of oil pressure gauge
> Hi Richard:
> Thanks for your reply.
> Excessive (sounds like a slapping noise) noise is what is making me think of an oil pressure gauge.
> There is also oil being forced out of the valve cover seal and bolts. Could this be a timing related issue? The black plastic roller for the chain was found to be worn a year ago. What are the consequences?
> Philip.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> From: tgm_enterprizes
> To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Fri, December 17, 2010 8:39:36 PM
> Subject: [anzhonda600owners] Re: Installation of oil pressure gauge
> I can understand the desire to have an oil pressure gauge, but lets say you get one and you find that you run 5 psi at normal speed (maybe that's ok, I have no idea). What will you do in that case... I am kind of saying that what use will it be since you aren't going to be able to change it. Remember this engine has roller bearings on rods and mains. My guess is you won't see a lot of oil pressure. plus, where would you put the gauge that it would look good?
> Richard
> --- In
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
, "TOM THIES" wrote:
> > Philip I believe that you will need to install an external oil filter and put the pressure gauge along the line. I don’t think there is any place on the motor to do it. But I may be wrong.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Philip Apronti
> > To:
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 3:53 PM
> > Subject: [anzhonda600owners] Installation of oil pressure gauge
> > Dear members:
> > I would like to install an oil pressure gauge on my N600 and would be grateful if any could give me tips on what and how to do it.
> > I intend to buy a gauge from m local auto patrs supply store.
> > Look forward to the advice.
> > Thanks.
> > Philip.
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > From: "billmyong@" >
> > To:
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
;
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Tue, December 14, 2010 11:56:56 AM
> > Subject: [anzhonda600owners] RE: [2cylinderhondas] Coupe and Sedan Values page
> > Thanks Steve!
> > Bill
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
]On Behalf Of Steven Michelsen
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2010 11:48 AM
> > To:
2cylinderhondas@yahoogroups.com
;
anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [2cylinderhondas] Coupe and Sedan Values page
> > I wanted to check on Honda 600 values and went to my own page...
http://www.honda600coupe.com/Honda_600_ ... alues.html
> > ...and found that the links didn't work anymore! It seems NADA changed their website around, so the links were no longer good. I re-did the page with new links and all is well again (in case you were looking)
> > Steve