Purchasing parts on line and from people who just don't know

[friend]

Note of caution;
Purchasing after market items from other parts suppliers and Ebay can cause
you more problems then you can imagine. And the Cam Chain is just one of
them. I have put an article up on the ANZhonda600owners yahoo group site
about changing your cam chain without pulling the engine. It also tells you
what signs to look for if you think your cam chain is stretched, and what
will happen if you keep running (driving) your Honda 600 with a warn cam
chain. So here is the chain I use and I can get them for any one who wants
to put the right chain back in their Honda 600 engine. But why replace the
cam chain?
What normally happens is your engine seems to be running a bit sluggish so
you adjusted your rockers and timed the engine by moving the vacuum advance,
you even set the points and fixed the breaker plate. But the cam seems to
be moving (rotating) toward the rear of the engine (the indicator is the
notch at the end of the cam - drivers side, is showing less and less in the
end cap opening). But the engine seems to be running better, so you drive
off. At about 60+ MPH your engine stops and some even lock up because when
the cam chain drops into the lower end it piles up around the gear on the
crankshaft. But before that happens the engine rotates a few times and the
cam doesn't so the valves that are open stay that way and the pistons move
up connecting with the valves bending them. Which causes loss of
compression. Some valves even put holes in the pistons or put a crack in
the top of the piston which is another problem you have to deal with.
Parts that have to be replaced:
Just the Valves, cam chain and all gaskets if every thing checks out ok.
But you also have to check out the crankshaft because the chain that
dropped to the bottom of the engine could have broken a tooth or even bent
the crank. and the pistons because they could have cracked or have a hole,
the connecting rod because it too could have compressed. But most of us put
the clutch in right away and shifted into neutral to coast to the side of
the freeway to call your local tow truck.
Sounds harsh, some think this could never happen to me. Believe me, I have
seen cam chains put holes in the lower engine case, rip slipper's (another
engine part) out of their mountings, bend the lower tensioner and I have
found parts of cam chains in the transmission. This is not something to
just put off. So you decide your engine needs a new cam chain;
First: Cam chains for both Sedan and Coupe are the same part. The cam
chain I use is heavy duty and has a Suzuki Racing application with 18K RPM
range and made in Japan. The rollers are 1 thousand (of and inch) larger
which takes up some of the wear between gear teeth on the Honda cam and
crank shaft gears (between a stretched chain and worn gears your cam chain
becomes an even larger problem). It comes with a hardened split link so
that the split link is just as durable as the rest of the links. You will
read and hear of other cam chains that are much cheaper, supposed to be
heavy duty, but their suppliers will not support it with engine applications
or RPM ranges. Every link on this chain is stamped with the manufacturers
code EK29H. None of the others I have seen even show who makes them. Oh
these sellers will tell you the chain is good, even heavy duty, but for what
application and at what RPM range? If it is for a 1K RPM range and you put
it in a Honda 600 which has a 5K to 6K RPM shift range then your setting
yourself up for a catastrophic event.
If you want the chain I use I will supply instructions on how to test your
current cam chain (while it's in the engine) to see if it is stretched.
Original cam chains stretch and are ready to break between 45K and 65K miles
of use depending on how the vehicle is driven (see note 1 below). Also,
stretched cam chains cause excessive wear on cam and crankshaft gear teeth
which can cause them to slip a tooth putting your engine out of time. And,
because the Honda 600 engine is not free running (the valves WILL touch
(impact) the pistons when out of time) your valves can touch the pistons
causing them to bend. So, a stretched/worn cam chain can really mess up an
engine. Your Honda 600 engine is a well designed unit, but when some parts
are driven past their limits they will cause catastrophic events to happen.
If you put a poor quality (after market) part in your engine the same thing
can happen.
The EK29H Cam chain is the same price Honda wants for theirs (if you can
find them).
Note 1: I rebuilt an engine replacing the cam chain with a new Honda cam
chain, and then tore the engine down every 10K miles and measured the timing
chain among other parts to see if there was a wear pattern. I took notes on
timing changes and viewed wear of the cam and crankshaft teeth. At 45k I
could see increased wear on the cam and the cam chain had stretched to a
point where it was almost a full link longer than the original chain.

[kamron gehlen]

i know the manuals say to drop the engine out the bottom with axels and all,but isn,t it easier to pull just the engine out the top?
billmyong@... wrote:

> Note of caution;
> Purchasing after market items from other parts suppliers and Ebay can cause > you more problems then you can imagine. And the Cam Chain is just one of > them. I have put an article up on the ANZhonda600owners yahoo group site > about changing your cam chain without pulling the engine. It also tells you > what signs to look for if you think your cam > chain is stretched, and what > will happen if you keep running (driving) your Honda 600 with a warn cam > chain. So here is the chain I use and I can get them for any one who wants > to put the right chain back in their Honda 600 engine. But why replace the > cam chain?
> What normally happens is your engine seems to be running a bit sluggish so > you adjusted your rockers and timed the engine by moving the vacuum advance, > you even set the points and fixed the breaker plate. But the cam seems to > be moving (rotating) toward the rear of the engine (the indicator is the > notch at the end of the cam - drivers side, is showing less and less in the > end cap opening). But the engine seems to be running better, so you drive > off. At about 60+ MPH your engine stops and some even lock up because when > the cam chain drops into the lower end it piles up around the gear on the > crankshaft. But before that happens the engine rotates a few times and the > cam > doesn't so the valves that are open stay that way and the pistons move > up connecting with the valves bending them. Which causes loss of > compression. Some valves even put holes in the pistons or put a crack in > the top of the piston which is another problem you have to deal with.
> Parts that have to be replaced:
> Just the Valves, cam chain and all gaskets if every thing checks out ok.
> But you also have to check out the crankshaft because the chain that > dropped to the bottom of the engine could have broken a tooth or even bent > the crank. and the pistons because they could have cracked or have a hole, > the connecting rod because it too could have compressed. But most of us put > the clutch in right away and shifted into neutral to coast to the side of > the freeway to call your local tow truck.
> Sounds harsh, some think this could never happen to me. Believe me, I have > seen cam chains put holes in the lower engine case, rip slipper's > (another > engine part) out of their mountings, bend the lower tensioner and I have > found parts of cam chains in the transmission. This is not something to > just put off. So you decide your engine needs a new cam chain; > First: Cam chains for both Sedan and Coupe are the same part. The cam > chain I use is heavy duty and has a Suzuki Racing application with 18K RPM > range and made in Japan. The rollers are 1 thousand (of and inch) larger > which takes up some of the wear between gear teeth on the Honda cam and > crank shaft gears (between a stretched chain and worn gears your cam chain > becomes an even larger problem). It comes with a hardened split link so > that the split link is just as durable as the rest of the links. You will > read and hear of other cam chains that are much cheaper, supposed to be > heavy duty, but their suppliers will not support it with engine applications > or RPM ranges. Every link on this chain is stamped with the > manufacturers > code EK29H. None of the others I have seen even show who makes them. Oh > these sellers will tell you the chain is good, even heavy duty, but for what > application and at what RPM range? If it is for a 1K RPM range and you put > it in a Honda 600 which has a 5K to 6K RPM shift range then your setting > yourself up for a catastrophic event.
> If you want the chain I use I will supply instructions on how to test your > current cam chain (while it's in the engine) to see if it is stretched.
> Original cam chains stretch and are ready to break between 45K and 65K miles > of use depending on how the vehicle is driven (see note 1 below). Also, > stretched cam chains cause excessive wear on cam and crankshaft gear teeth > which can cause them to slip a tooth putting your engine out of time. And, > because the Honda 600 engine is not free running (the valves WILL touch > (impact) the pistons when out of time) your valves can touch the > pistons > causing them to bend. So, a stretched/worn cam chain can really mess up an > engine. Your Honda 600 engine is a well designed unit, but when some parts > are driven past their limits they will cause catastrophic events to happen.
> If you put a poor quality (after market) part in your engine the same thing > can happen.
> The EK29H Cam chain is the same price Honda wants for theirs (if you can > find them).
> Note 1: I rebuilt an engine replacing the cam chain with a new Honda cam > chain, and then tore the engine down every 10K miles and measured the timing > chain among other parts to see if there was a wear pattern. I took notes on > timing changes and viewed wear of the cam and crankshaft teeth. At 45k I > could see increased wear on the cam and the cam chain had stretched to a > point where it was almost a full link longer than the original chain.
Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people.
Go to Yahoo! Answers.

[friend]

No, you can drop an engine unit in 30 minutes by lifting the body off the sub frame.
Bill

> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com]
> On Behalf Of
> kamron
> gehlen
> Sent:
> Saturday, July 07, 2007 9:14 AM
> To:
> anzhonda600owners@yahoogroups.com
> Subject:
> Re: [anzhonda600owners]
> Purchasing parts on line and from people who just don't
> know
> i know the manuals say to drop the engine out the bottom with axels and > all,but isn,t it easier to pull just the engine out the > top?
> billmyong@earthlink .net
> wrote:
> > Note of caution;
> > Purchasing after market items from other parts
> > suppliers and Ebay can cause
> > you more problems then you can imagine. And
> > the Cam Chain is just one of
> > them. I have put an article up on the
> > ANZhonda600owners yahoo group site
> > about changing your cam chain without
> > pulling the engine. It also tells you
> > what signs to look for if you think
> > your cam chain is stretched, and what
> > will happen if you keep running
> > (driving) your Honda 600 with a warn cam
> > chain. So here is the chain I
> > use and I can get them for any one who wants
> > to put the right chain back
> > in their Honda 600 engine. But why replace the
> > cam chain?
> > What
> > normally happens is your engine seems to be running a bit sluggish so > > you > > adjusted your rockers and timed the engine by moving the vacuum > > advance, > > you even set the points and fixed the breaker plate. But the cam > > seems to > > be moving (rotating) toward the rear of the engine (the > > indicator is the > > notch at the end of the cam - drivers side, is showing > > less and less in the > > end cap opening). But the engine seems to be running > > better, so you drive > > off. At about 60+ MPH your engine stops and some > > even lock up because when > > the cam chain drops into the lower end it piles > > up around the gear on the > > crankshaft. But before that happens the engine > > rotates a few times and the > > cam doesn't so the valves that are open stay > > that way and the pistons move > > up connecting with the valves bending them.
> > Which causes loss of
> > compression. Some valves even put holes in the
> > pistons or put a crack in
> > the top of the piston which is another problem
> > you have to deal with.
> > Parts that have to be replaced:
> > Just the
> > Valves, cam chain and all gaskets if every thing checks out ok.
> > But you
> > also have to check out the crankshaft because the chain that > > dropped to > > the bottom of the engine could have broken a tooth or even bent > > the > > crank. and the pistons because they could have cracked or have a > > hole, > > the connecting rod because it too could have compressed. But most > > of us put > > the clutch in right away and shifted into neutral to coast to > > the side of > > the freeway to call your local tow truck.
> > Sounds
> > harsh, some think this could never happen to me. Believe me, I have > > seen > > cam chains put holes in the lower engine case, rip slipper's > > (another > > engine part) out of their mountings, bend the lower tensioner > > and I have > > found parts of cam chains in the transmission. This is not > > something to > > just put off. So you decide your engine needs a new cam > > chain; > > First: Cam chains for both Sedan and Coupe are the same part.
> > The cam
> > chain I use is heavy duty and has a Suzuki Racing application > > with 18K RPM > > range and made in Japan. The rollers are 1 thousand (of and > > inch) larger > > which takes up some of the wear between gear teeth on the > > Honda cam and > > crank shaft gears (between a stretched chain and worn gears > > your cam chain > > becomes an even larger problem). It comes with a hardened > > split link so > > that the split link is just as durable as the rest of the > > links. You will > > read and hear of other cam chains that are much cheaper, > > supposed to be > > heavy duty, but their suppliers will not support it with > > engine applications > > or RPM ranges. Every link on this chain is stamped > > with the manufacturers > > code EK29H. None of the others I have seen even > > show who makes them. Oh > > these sellers will tell you the chain is good, > > even heavy duty, but for what > > application and at what RPM range? If it is > > for a 1K RPM range and you put > > it in a Honda 600 which has a 5K to 6K RPM > > shift range then your setting > > yourself up for a catastrophic > > event.
> > If you want the chain I use I will supply instructions on how > > to test your > > current cam chain (while it's in the engine) to see if it is > > stretched.
> > Original cam chains stretch and are ready to break between 45K > > and 65K miles > > of use depending on how the vehicle is driven (see note 1 > > below). Also, > > stretched cam chains cause excessive wear on cam and > > crankshaft gear teeth > > which can cause them to slip a tooth putting your > > engine out of time. And, > > because the Honda 600 engine is not free running > > (the valves WILL touch > > (impact) the pistons when out of time) your valves > > can touch the pistons > > causing them to bend. So, a stretched/worn cam > > chain can really mess up an > > engine. Your Honda 600 engine is a well > > designed unit, but when some parts > > are driven past their limits they will > > cause catastrophic events to happen.
> > If you put a poor quality (after
> > market) part in your engine the same thing
> > can happen.
> > The EK29H
> > Cam chain is the same price Honda wants for theirs (if you can > > find > > them).
> > Note 1: I rebuilt an engine replacing the cam chain with a new > > Honda cam > > chain, and then tore the engine down every 10K miles and > > measured the timing > > chain among other parts to see if there was a wear > > pattern. I took notes on > > timing changes and viewed wear of the cam and > > crankshaft teeth. At 45k I > > could see increased wear on the cam and the > > cam chain had stretched to a > > point where it was almost a full link longer > > than the original > > chain.
> Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people.
> Go to Yahoo! Answers.

[Gregg Sydenstricker]

how much for the aftermarket chain  .
thanks Gregg

> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> billmyong@...
> To:
> Anzhonda600owners
> Sent:
> Saturday, July 07, 2007 6:03
> AM
> Subject:
> [anzhonda600owners] Purchasing
> parts on line and from people who just don't know
> Note of caution;
> Purchasing after market items from other parts
> suppliers and Ebay can cause
> you more problems then you can imagine. And
> the Cam Chain is just one of
> them. I have put an article up on the
> ANZhonda600owners yahoo group site
> about changing your cam chain without
> pulling the engine. It also tells you
> what signs to look for if you think
> your cam chain is stretched, and what
> will happen if you keep running
> (driving) your Honda 600 with a warn cam
> chain. So here is the chain I use
> and I can get them for any one who wants
> to put the right chain back in
> their Honda 600 engine. But why replace the
> cam chain?
> What normally
> happens is your engine seems to be running a bit sluggish so > you adjusted > your rockers and timed the engine by moving the vacuum advance, > you even > set the points and fixed the breaker plate. But the cam seems to > be moving > (rotating) toward the rear of the engine (the indicator is the > notch at the > end of the cam - drivers side, is showing less and less in the > end cap > opening). But the engine seems to be running better, so you drive > off. At > about 60+ MPH your engine stops and some even lock up because when > the cam > chain drops into the lower end it piles up around the gear on > the > crankshaft. But before that happens the engine rotates a few times and > the > cam doesn't so the valves that are open stay that way and the pistons > move > up connecting with the valves bending them. Which causes loss > of > compression. Some valves even put holes in the pistons or put a crack > in > the top of the piston which is another problem you have to deal > with.
> Parts that have to be replaced:
> Just the Valves, cam chain and all
> gaskets if every thing checks out ok.
> But you also have to check out the
> crankshaft because the chain that
> dropped to the bottom of the engine could
> have broken a tooth or even bent
> the crank. and the pistons because they
> could have cracked or have a hole,
> the connecting rod because it too could
> have compressed. But most of us put
> the clutch in right away and shifted
> into neutral to coast to the side of
> the freeway to call your local tow
> truck.
> Sounds harsh, some think this could never happen to me. Believe > me, I have > seen cam chains put holes in the lower engine case, rip > slipper's (another > engine part) out of their mountings, bend the lower > tensioner and I have > found parts of cam chains in the transmission. This is > not something to > just put off. So you decide your engine needs a new cam > chain; > First: Cam chains for both Sedan and Coupe are the same part.
> The cam
> chain I use is heavy duty and has a Suzuki Racing application with > 18K RPM > range and made in Japan. The rollers are 1 thousand (of and inch) > larger > which takes up some of the wear between gear teeth on the Honda cam > and > crank shaft gears (between a stretched chain and worn gears your cam > chain > becomes an even larger problem). It comes with a hardened split link > so > that the split link is just as durable as the rest of the links. You > will > read and hear of other cam chains that are much cheaper, supposed to > be > heavy duty, but their suppliers will not support it with engine > applications > or RPM ranges. Every link on this chain is stamped with the > manufacturers > code EK29H. None of the others I have seen even show who > makes them. Oh > these sellers will tell you the chain is good, even heavy > duty, but for what > application and at what RPM range? If it is for a 1K RPM > range and you put > it in a Honda 600 which has a 5K to 6K RPM shift range > then your setting > yourself up for a catastrophic event.
> If you want
> the chain I use I will supply instructions on how to test your > current cam > chain (while it's in the engine) to see if it is stretched.
> Original cam
> chains stretch and are ready to break between 45K and 65K miles > of use > depending on how the vehicle is driven (see note 1 below). Also, > stretched > cam chains cause excessive wear on cam and crankshaft gear teeth > which can > cause them to slip a tooth putting your engine out of time. And, > because > the Honda 600 engine is not free running (the valves WILL touch > (impact) > the pistons when out of time) your valves can touch the pistons > causing > them to bend. So, a stretched/worn cam chain can really mess up an > engine.
> Your Honda 600 engine is a well designed unit, but when some parts > are > driven past their limits they will cause catastrophic events to happen.
> If
> you put a poor quality (after market) part in your engine the same > thing > can happen.
> The EK29H Cam chain is the same price Honda wants
> for theirs (if you can
> find them).
> Note 1: I rebuilt an engine
> replacing the cam chain with a new Honda cam
> chain, and then tore the
> engine down every 10K miles and measured the timing
> chain among other parts
> to see if there was a wear pattern. I took notes on
> timing changes and
> viewed wear of the cam and crankshaft teeth. At 45k I
> could see increased
> wear on the cam and the cam chain had stretched to a
> point where it was
> almost a full link longer than the original chain.